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All star Batman and Robin the Boy Wonder..


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Kickthekitty
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« on: May 30, 2010, 05:22:35 pm »

I first were planning to make a other kind of thread. Something like "Great moments of comics" and mention one scene from this series. But it quickly became obvious I couldn't. Clearly before I can address one scene of this series, I have to review entirety a little bit.


I'm not going to write actual review. There are already plenty.
Positive: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=user_review&id=1730
Negative: http://www.aintitcool.com/node/32767
VERY negative: http://www.i-mockery.com/comics/longbox7/default.php
Extremely negative: http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/linkara/at4w/13422-asbr01 (This one is actually a entertaining video and I recommend watching it if you're interested dissecting this series. Though narrator seems to have something personal against Miller. But he starts speaking about comic soon enough. Jump over first 4 and half minutes.  I shall comment some of the issues that are raised.)


At first let me mention that I really love this series. And yet I think it's rather average. That's not contradiction. I like lot of things which are average or even bad. Personal taste is funny that way. Just because I like it wont mean I wouldn't acknowledge it's bad parts.

What striked me, hit me, hurt me, made me headbang, was the utter lack of a plot. Any plot. There really ain't any. It moves from one great scene to another but without much of a connection. Here an analogue for you; "What would Batman: Arkham Asylum (game) be without Joker?". Nothing but a huge riot where Batman would just wander around beating thughs and villains. Good stuff but nothing special.
If only this series had a plot it would be a masterpiece. Because it does have everything else. It's different. It has some extreme yet familiar characters. And it has a very powerful ambience. If it only had a plot then even the most negative critic would be forced to announce: "...yet even though I hated it, it's still a masterpiece."
But alas, no plot.
SO WHAT.
This is not the first comic series without any real plot. There have been plenty. And this is certainly not a worst of such.
No. The real problem here seems to be that it was written by Frank Miller.
Were you insulted that Miller can't (for some reason) make Earth shaking masterpieces every time? That there are mediocre works in between?
I'm guessing this is some kind of god complex. People considered Miller to be somekind of god. And yet this time his creation wasn't perfect.


Anyway, onward. Those reviews I posted covered almost all bases but that last one (thatguywiththeglasses), while raised significant issues, gave wrong conclusions I think.  The first review (comicbookresources) counters some of the those but not all. So I shall be commenting rest (except for no-brainers)

-Series has extremely gritty, stupid, sometimes even retarded internal monologies as well as dialogies.
I agree. It has. And I understand that many wont like that. But it has it's sides. Q:What would realistic thoughts be like in the middle of action? A:Utterly incoherent, self-repeating, curses. Miller doesn't go all the way to realism (thank god). He keeps it readable. Yet giving a feeling of realism. I consider that to be type of art.

-Miller shows women as scantily-clad dumb sluts. Also too much fanservice.
Okey. Let me deal with latter first. I love fan service. In all of it's forms. I don't think I have ever run in to series which I thought had too much fanservice. (If you have then give me it's name and I shall check it immediately. ^^) And let's be honest here, fanservice sells.
Alright, forward. Let's ignore all those female main and side characters who are indeed not acting like sluts and wear normally covering clothes. And let's also ignore superheroines since it is the main point of this series that all superheros are mentalcases.
Reporter Vicky. Bruce doesn't date woman for their minds. And he doesn't date woman for their looks either. His dates are merely a mean to keep up his playboy facade. He might wanna change to Batman in the middle of the date and therefore the main date requirement is IQ under 70. That's common sence.
But frankly there was no need for Vicky in this story. Or she didn't have to be Bruse's dumb date. (Miller tries to work around this writing that Vicky is only dumb when she's with Bruce and otherwise very intelligent. That doesn't really work.)  So, he is quilty as charged. He had a shallow main character almost only as a cheesecake. A serious flaw in writing. And again "so what". There have been how many such comics before? Or is it somehow worse if it's Miller who does it?

-Batmobile cuts through a cop car and then starts to fly. Where are the physics?!
What Miller does first, others will follow. Check out Batman and Robin (2009) #1. Flying batmobile has became a norm. And compared to that, cutting a car is childs play.

-Batman shouldn't ever say "cool". He's too cool for that. (issue 2 page 10, issue 4 page 13)
This Batman isn't cool. Not yet. He's still growing as a character. Or perhaps he has barely started growing. There are only two times in the series (as far) where Batman is cool. A hero so to speak. At issue 9 page 19 he rips of his mask to better give first aid for a man he despises. Thus revealing his identity to 12 year old kid, who is in somewhat unbalanced mental state. And also risks having Hal Jordan (and therefore all the rest of JLA too) finding it out as well. Second time is in same issue page 24. Now that took guts.



Now let me summarise this. This series is good. It's not great. It's not bad. It's average. Surely even Miller has right to make average book now and then.
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domino1284
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« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2010, 01:07:33 pm »

The series for me isn't bad because it has no plot or Batman has a huge ego. Its that it portrays Frank Millers new found ego. He seems to be full of himself a lot of times after finding success.

It wasn't just this, I also found DK2 as him being full of himself. He did better with Year One. Bruce Wayne has started his career, still learning the ropes. This Batman is just a got gone crazy. Just because he is in a Batsuit doesn't mean he is a good Batman. I do love the artwork, I want the artist to stay and a new writer to come in.

By comparison, All-Star Superman is perfect. Self contained, not over the type.
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Kickthekitty
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« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2010, 03:16:57 pm »

So, you do dislike this series because it's written by Miller? How about separate from him?
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